Sump plate studs

[limeyrob]

OK I've got an alloy sump plate I want to fit because its got a nice big drain plug.
Its about 5/16 thicker than the steel one so I'll need longer studs. 
Part is 31-0222 which is listed as 1/4 BSW x 1/4 BSC x 7/8"
Does anyone know of a longer stud - around 1 1/4"?
I'm thinking perhaps one of the oil pump studs?
Its all a bit of a faff as I'll have to helicoil the crankcase threads in-situe as I know at least one is on its last legs.  Once helicoiled I could go for 1/4 Whit cap heads but I'd prefer studs.
Plan is to drill and tap the drain plug on the new sump and put a brake bleed nipple in so its easy to drain the wet sump oil into a tube and jar.  Looks do-able as the plug is at 45 deg on the rear so there's some space.
Plan is to lay the bike over, stuff the engine with clean rag then drill, tap and helicoil then flush with brake cleaner.

[berger]

a car brake bleed nipple? , golly gosh have you a day spare to let it drain

[groily]

Is this an SRM-like one Rob? Theirs are supplied with capheads, or were, but studs 'n nuts (two of, or nylock or those steel ones with grippy tops) have to be better. The drain plug on theirs is quite accessible if the plate is fitted with drainage in mind, no need for a bleed valve I wouldn't think. I quite liked my SRM one after I'd ditched their screws. Studs are an easy 'make' if you've got a die or two and a bit of 1/4" round stock. There may be off-the-shelfs that would do, dunno.

Good luck helicoiling the c/case threads . . . Bike laid over on side? Or up in the rafters? Need 'em in straight, or the thicker plate will argue with you on its way on and off.

[limeyrob]

My gut says studs are better, even with helicoils I'm wary of unscrewing in ally but reality is it should never come off so I've ordered some cap heads as a stop gap.  Plan is a bleed nipple in the drain with tube into a jar - I can leave it open and close it before riding off after I've poured the oil back in the tank. Well that's the plan.
I'm looking for simple reversible mods that have less risk of me forgetting and can't seize the engine if I do.  At the moment I drain the sump before a ride but its a tapped 3/8 BSC plug in the steel plate and there's not a lot of thread.  The brass drain in the ally plate is much nicer than I expected so i may just file a flat on that 2 turns in so i just undo it 3 turns to drain.
My absolute biggest fear is messing up the helicoils and screwing up a case.  Plenty of tea and thought before the first metal comes off!!

[CheeserBeezer]

When I fit these, I enlarge the four holes on the sump plate and use tappet cover nuts so their sleeves reach into the sump plate. The tappet cover nuts will then thread onto the original studs. I skim the nuts down a bit so they are a bit slimmer.

[bl**dydrivers]

Motalia, does a nice set of long studs and you are in UK so postage wouldn’t be a killer.
Have used them a few times and are of good quality!

https://www.motalia.co.uk/W1-18..html

[bikerboy]

Dont be lazy Rob cure the wet sumping issue 

[limeyrob]

 
I know that's where this will end up, there's an awful inevitability to it.

[ringding]

A numpty question, is the  non return valve (the ball and spring) only serviceable with the engine out? I'm thinking of my '57 A7 here.

When I changed the sump plate on my Barracuda I had the same issue with studs. I swapped them out for bolts in the end, it was the easiest path for me.

[Swarfcut]

 If you are talking the anti wet sump valve, strictly speaking it's more of a hold back the tide valve. Sadly on a standard engine this can only be accessed with the crankcases split. Later A65 etc put the valve under the oil pump, so can be serviced in situ. A7/A10 can be adapted, in a similar way, plenty on the Forum.

 Non return valve in the sump is on the return or scavenge side of the pump .Just a simple ball valve, held closed by faith, hope and gravity. In theory this can be removed on S/A crankcases without dismantling, but why this would be needed beats me. Plunger bikes have a different arrangement, pipe has a welded bend, which splits, pump can't scavenge. Engine out, down to bare crankcase to fix.

 Swarfy.

[limeyrob]

What frustrates me about this is that my current A10 is all rebuilt with a new spring, re-seated ball etc and it wet sumps 1/4 pint a week.  I've had clapped out engines sit for months and smoke for a few minutes on start up.

[groily]

Depends how often you run it I guess Rob, but I wouldn't bother draining for 1/4 pint, or 1/2 for that matter. Just don't top up until it's run for a bit!
Before I split my cases and replaced said bits while sorting out the drive side shimming on my A, it would sometimes have at least that in there, but it pumped it back pretty quickly if run at a fast tickover for a few. My B never let a drop through, nor used a drop between oil changes, even better.
Replacement of the ball and spring on the A did the job in my case and it never leaked afterwards. A  far cry from several other less continent machines round here, but as I suffer from the delusion that the Perfect is the Enemy of the Good, I'm not averse to taps (big bore ones mind) and mag cut-outs on them.

[Roger (Doomtrainbarx)]

I have 3 bikes that all wet sump to various degrees - I just fire them all up every 2 -4 weeks and let the pump scavenge away the excess oil - seems the obvious thing to do.

[limeyrob]

I have a Matchless and the A10, both get run every week of two. The Matchless does wet sump but it only shows on the return (no bubbles) its not smoky.  The A10 however will produce a solid could of smoke that goes 2 or 3 gardens down and lasts for ages.  Considering how good a condition the engine is its beyond annoying.  It has an oil filter on the return and I'm now wondering if that empties into the engine too.  If its that I should see a rapid rise int eh first day or two then a much slower one.  Its a bit cold just now but I'll check when the weather is nicer.

[Rex]

The problem could be "both get run every week or two" as if they're fired up and run for a couple minutes, the oil never gets hot and thin, and so the ball valve never gets to seat properly again due to the viscous cold oil.