Author Topic: Battery dieing early  (Read 2175 times)

Offline muskrat

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Battery dieing early
« on: 16.10. 2023 21:26 »
G'day Fellas.
Going over the A7 plunger I put the 12v battery on charge. After about 15 minutes and got up to 4 on the 7 stage charger the charger started to beep. It said battery fault. I put my tester on it and it said replace! It's only a year old YTX7L-BS. I had noticed the amp gauge.. showing 8 amps at anything over 1500rpm. Even with the headlight on it showed 4 amps. Now looking at replacing it with an AGM YTX14AHL-BS, a little larger and won't be able to use the rubber battery box. *pull hair out*
I don't usually ride with the lights on but I have Electronic ignition so need a good battery.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS racer now a A10CR, '78 XT500, '83 CB1100F, 88 HD FXST, 2000 CBR929RR ex Honda Australia Superbike .
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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #1 on: 16.10. 2023 22:09 »
Have you checked the output voltage from the regulator, Musky? High voltage will kill a battery.

Offline a10 gf

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #2 on: 16.10. 2023 22:23 »
Ever went to zero anytime? Batteries (lead\acid) that have been emptied may (many say 'will') never behave well thereafter. Worse, empty then freezing cold.


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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #3 on: 16.10. 2023 23:17 »
something amiss musky if it's pushing that much current into the battery unless only having a 6amp hour one on it with 12volt ignition ?? its not gutsy enough.  i can remember trying to run just lights or not even lights with a 12v  3ah lithium and it cabbaged the regulator . i upped it to 9 ah and now get a steady charge of 1 to 2 amps at anything over about 1800 revs lights on or off

Offline muskrat

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #4 on: 17.10. 2023 09:57 »
G'day Fellas.
Trevor, no I didn't. I'll pull a battery out of one of the other bikes tomorrow night and test it or should I test with the old one?. It has a standard E3L running through a DVRII set for 12v.
Berger, what bike did you have with a lithium battery? Most old bikes won't charge them and they can't take vibes.
a10gf, only had a few -C's in the shed this winter and only one night out of the shed at -3 (she wouldn't fit in the tent with me). I can't recall if the problem started after that.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS racer now a A10CR, '78 XT500, '83 CB1100F, 88 HD FXST, 2000 CBR929RR ex Honda Australia Superbike .
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Muskys Plunger A7

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #5 on: 17.10. 2023 10:51 »
With the DVR Musky you can test without the battery if need be. But not with electronic ignition!  Measure the voltage between the A lead and earth and see what happens as you rev. Should stabilise at about 14v (bit spikey on a digital meter) with revs. If voltage keeps on going up, towards maybe 20v or even a tad more, then 'snot regulating. (I had one DVR stop regulating - it had done well for 10+ years, so not complaining.)
Won't have been doing the dyn any good to be chucking out enough for 'tronic ign  plus lighting loads plus 4 amps on top I wouldn't think  . . . best get to bottom of the problem before there are smells and smoke.
Bigger battery may well help (or just disguise an issue?), but it's what spews out of the A wire that's the first thing to figure, along with what the ammeter then says with a battery hooked up, preferably a charged one of reasonable size! I've run with cheapskate undersized batteries on and off in the exact same configuration you have got, and haven't had this sort of thing happen even with Hot Hands (35W) and a tungsten globe (36W) and all-up 75W-ish continuous loads.
Bill

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #6 on: 17.10. 2023 11:49 »
Musky the battery is on my bike under the hump on the seat , seat is fibre glass sat on rubber buffers and battery is in a bubble wrap cushion, you can't feel the vibes on the seat it just gently bounces on the back end at times depending on revs. i did find that if a lithium has drained to very low voltage they  are either scrap or take a very long time to get some life in them on a trickle charger.

Offline muskrat

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #7 on: 17.10. 2023 18:42 »
G'day groily, thanks for your thoughts.
When you say A lead do you mean the wire going to the ammeter? One side of meter to wire (disconnected) the other side to ammeter pole or just ammeter pole to earth?
I'm still in pre-school when it comes to electrickery!

G'day bergs.
What reg/rec are you using? Li batteries need to be charged at 14 to 15 volts.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS racer now a A10CR, '78 XT500, '83 CB1100F, 88 HD FXST, 2000 CBR929RR ex Honda Australia Superbike .
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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #8 on: 17.10. 2023 19:16 »
musky DVR2 thing and it all works well together with the 12v dynamo, it's been sound for years ,   ahem he says now

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #9 on: 17.10. 2023 21:15 »
When you say A lead do you mean the wire going to the ammeter?
I do Musky. On the DVR there are 4 wires. At 12v it's yellow and green FROM the dynamo, and then the brown one to the ammeter/switch and red or black to earth depending on whether you're + or - earth.  The 5th wire, white, is suppressed at 12v.

But a Q here is whether with the electronic ignition you have, if you disconnect the power from the regulator to the battery after starting, will the engine just die? It might if the battery is on the dead side of flat and can't supply the necessary without the dynamo connected to boost it.
If the engine will run off just the battery (or a better one pulled off another bike maybe), then you could disconnect the A wire from the DVR2 (anywhere there's a connector you can get at) and measure the voltage between the end of the wire and earth as the engine runs.

If the thing won't run with the A wire disconnected you could just do the 'normal' thing and measure voltage across the battery terminals with the engine running to see what happens with varying rpm, without disconnecting anything. But it might not tell you as much as you want if the battery is dead as Monty Python's parrot.

From what you've described at the start of the thread, I reckon either the regulator isn't working and it's buggered the battery due to overcharging (made worse by its small capacity perhaps) or the battery is so fubarred that the regulator has lost its way and is telling the dynamo to generate absurd amounts of current, which it can't do indefinitely without having a hissy fit. But wtfdik?
Bill

Offline muskrat

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #10 on: 17.10. 2023 21:29 »
Thanks Bill.
 I'll try a few tests tonight. I have another DVRII on the Cafe I could swap over.
Off to work now.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS racer now a A10CR, '78 XT500, '83 CB1100F, 88 HD FXST, 2000 CBR929RR ex Honda Australia Superbike .
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Muskys Plunger A7

Offline muskrat

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #11 on: 18.10. 2023 10:27 »
G'day Bill.
OK she will run with the A wire disconnected. The easiest place to plug in was the wire connected to the ammeter. I was able to use the duff battery. At idle it was only showing 3v, at 2500rpm showed 13.5v, at 4000rpm showed 14.6v. That's about when my digital meter went crazy. I don't have an analog meter, I'll look at getting one.
So my thoughts are a duff battery. The DVRII seems to be working as normal.
For many years I only had a Century PS1240 12v 4AH AGM Battery. I'll see if I can get the YTX14AHL-BS local and try it.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS racer now a A10CR, '78 XT500, '83 CB1100F, 88 HD FXST, 2000 CBR929RR ex Honda Australia Superbike .
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Muskys Plunger A7

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #12 on: 18.10. 2023 10:36 »
Sounds as if the DVR is OK Musky - excellent! Spiky readings always on digi meters, but I wouldn't go and buy a good analog one just on those grounds. I use a decent quality digital one from Radio Spares usually, and it tells me what I need pretty well.
If you put a different battery on and  the ammeter shows 'sensible', all should be fine again.
Bill

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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #13 on: 19.10. 2023 10:44 »
G'day Fellas/Bill.
The plot thickens. Bought a Motobatt MB10U 14.5 Ah $125. Tester said 99% charge. Threw it on and amp gauge said same as before. Only did the across the poles test but this time with my Pro Digital multi meter, same as before *pull hair out* it did flash 17v before giving up at about 4500rpm. WTF!

I'll rebuild a motor in my sleep but electricks are giving me a shock!
Analog meter n my shopping list.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS racer now a A10CR, '78 XT500, '83 CB1100F, 88 HD FXST, 2000 CBR929RR ex Honda Australia Superbike .
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Re: Battery dieing early
« Reply #14 on: 19.10. 2023 10:55 »
Musky i gave up with my digi meter when testing dynamo output it was giving silly readings up to 22volts and jumping about all over the place.