Small vintage lathes

[Greybeard]

I take it the purpose is to push on a tap to keep it centered while getting it started into a workpiece that is either on the lathe or a drill press. Correct?

Correct. 👍

Thank you for the compliments 🙏

[groily]

More resourcefulness GB! You are clearly 'hooked'!

Can't say I've actually used a tap follower myself, as I usually use a tailstock chuck (4 jaw if can be bothered, otherwise just gripping by the round bit in a 3 jaw) to get things started. (If using the lathe that is, and turning the headstock by hand with the drive 'loose', tailstock free to slide, obvs!)
Then finish on the bench.
Rather than using a sprung centre and a separate wrench, which I don't find all that convenient.

Call me a total coward, but I've never driven taps (even the 'machine' sort) or dies under power  . . . But then, we're not under time and motion pressure to do several hundred repetitions an hour  . . . .

Worth saying, maybe,  that it may also be useful, while you're in 'make bits' mode, to think about some die holders on 1MT blanks (or plain shanks that can go in a chuck)? I made a series of them for different diameter dies years ago, and it sure as heck reduces drunkenness to a minimum. Some bits of bored out round stock, some suitably disposed grub screws and 'one for the gap' in split dies, and away you go.
Also, a 'running chuck' can be really handy. To achieve which, I replicated the Myford headstock spindle on a chunk of stainless, shoved a pair of bearings up it and a 2MT blank to hold it, and voilà, a free-spinning chuck or face plate to go either end of the lathe (on a 2MT'd 7 series) . I find it very useful anyway, in an anoraky sort of way.

[RDfella]

When running a thread up a bar it always wants to go off centre so there's hardly any thread on one side. (unless using a coventry die box that is). My solution is to hold the die in a conventional holder, put the lathe in slow (mine drops to 10rpm) and keep the chuck (with jaws drawn back) in the tailstock lightly pressed against the holder most of the way. Quick and easy. I have die holders which slide along a bar mounted in the tailstock, but rarely use them.

[Greybeard]

Groily,
I intend to make a die holder for the lathe. The one from my cheap set is pretty poor.

I've been putting the die in the holder backwards so I can bring the empty tailstock spindle to bear on the die rather than the more enclosed side of the die holder.

I have been running the lathe in slow reverse to get the tap or die out a bit quicker.

[groily]

Worth bearing in mind GB that most good dies have the 'start this side' or equiv marking because of the lead-in, so not 100% sure about that. RD will maybe say summat pertinent!
I do reverse dies now and then to get thread right up to the shoulders on screws that need it, but am otherwise a wee bit cautious; being the ultimate cheapskate, I hate replacing things because I've misused them  . . . but sadly, it happens all the same!
The dies I like best are the ones with an integral adjusting screw at a tangent to the hole in the middle to set the clearance and cut to full depth by stages, but I don't have a whole lot of them, mostly in UNF and UNC from the good 'ole US of A. I think they were expensive!
But good luck knocking out better than the cheesey monkey-metal many of the die-holders out there are made of - they are pretty crap some of them.

[Greybeard]

Groily,
I meant that I place the die in the holder back to front so the tapered lead-in is now on what would normally be the reverse of the holder. This leaves the back of the die exposed and facing my tailstock so the spindle can be pushed squarely against the die rather than the metal frame of the holder. This is to get the die square against the workpiece.

[Rex]

Like any Far Eastern products some are OK and others are not so OK. I'm satisfied with my tail stock die holder (never used under power though!) but an Indian-made BSF tap and die set has the cheapest off-centre and eccentric die holders imaginable.
Bought as a present, though the taps and dies themselves are passable as thread chasers, they aren't a patch on some older incomplete Presto sets I have.

[RDfella]

The dies I like best are the ones with an integral adjusting screw at a tangent to the hole in the middle to set the clearance and cut to full depth by stages, but I don't have a whole lot of them, mostly in UNF and UNC from the good 'ole US of A. I think they were expensive!

Not 'Little Giant' by any chance? I have a set (UNF / UNC) where each diameter has its own holder with guide screwed into the holder to maintain concentricity. The die itself cpmes as a pair, each adjusted by a screw in the holder. Sadly, mine are now tired - wonder if spares are available?

[groily]

Groily,
I meant that I place the die in the holder back to front so the tapered lead-in is now on what would normally be the reverse of the holder. This leaves the back of the die exposed and facing my tailstock so the spindle can be pushed squarely against the die rather than the metal frame of the holder. This is to get the die square against the workpiece.

Ah, gotya GB! My mistake, sorry to have misunderstood you.

Will have a look at the dies I have tomorrow RD, to see if names visible. I also have some top-draw metric stuff, with conical dies of a sort I'd never seen till I got them fifteenth hand no doubt (but unused pretty much)  . . .  will take a pic tomorrow  . . .

[groily]

As threatened RD - dies.

Not Little Giants, just Irwin / Hanson in the UNF / C set. As you can see if you look closely, they've got the in-built adjuster screw, which is screwed in a bit to open them and vice versa. Grub screws at 180/180, which makes it simplest to use the die holder that came in the set (with one of those not all-that-brilliant three-screw-operated adjustable guides or 'steadies'), although I made other holders for use in pillar drill, lathe etc.
Our friends in the US will know more about the quality of one domestic marque versus another, but I seem to recall that the Irwin / Hanson tools had / have a good reputation. I've had this set for 25 years and it's done well. Shame the box is plastic, is my only gripe!

For something very impressive though, have a gander at these metric jobbies. Each die is multi-part, on pins, conical form, with a circlip holding things together. Slip die into one of or other of the holders (standard wrench, another option for lathe use, or a half-inch socket drive box), screw on the beautifully-made 'lid' (expensive camera lense cover quality) and set using the knurled screw. Pretty old I think, but in superb order.  A few extras in there too. Range is 4mm to 16mm, with a couple of duplicates.
Over here, one does need the two pitches at 4 and 5mm quite often, also the 7 x 1mm found all over the place - their near equiv of 1/4 Cycle. (8, 9 & 10 x 1mm would be nice too, but can't have everything!)
Of the tackle I have, this is the nicest to handle, and look at that engraving! Gallic Pride! I hate to think what it would cost in beer vouchers to make a set like that nowadays  . . .

[Greybeard]

Ooh, lovely grub! 😊

[RDfella]

Here's pics of the 'Little Giant' die set (made in USA I believe). The 2nd pic shows one die dismantled. Set is getting tired now, unfortunately but its design avoids a thread 'running off' when done by hand.

Addendum - just looked up 'Greenfield' (the manufacturer). Still in business and making a vast array of taps / dies, mostly to the same pattern. Prices eye-watering.

[RichardL]

C.H Hanson is literally 10 minutes from me and 2 minutes from my office, when I used to work from there. I does not appear that tap and die sets are still in their product line. Irwin is sold here in home improvement stores as the next step up in quality and price above whatever that store's private-label, even-cheaper-Asian, brand happens to be.

Richard L.

[groily]

Thanks for that Richard L. Makes perfect sense.

And very clever, those Little Giants RDfella. Look really excellent - and I'm not the least surprised about the 'eye-watering' addendum.

-------------------

Had a couple of mates round this afternoon who are much more experienced than me, to play with that 'new' Drummond round bed of mine now it's up and running . . .
Comments included:
"Pretty but best to Polish and Put on Display" - "Too awkward for serious practical use these days - "Hats off to those who did amazing things with them back in the day" - "Screw-cutting without back gearing? . .  'pon my Soul!" - "Oops, who pinched the compound slide?" and similar  . . .

Very fair comments. But I am lost in admiration for the perseverance and patience of those who made things like working steam and internal combustion engines using such basic kit. Incredible really.

Tony at that great repository of info on all these things, lathes.co.uk, reckoned it fully deserved to be put back into working order, as there are only a few surviving 'long bed' versions. That much, I can say is 'Done'.

So, there we go.

[BSA_54A10]

Here's pics of the 'Little Giant' die set (made in USA I believe). The 2nd pic shows one die dismantled. Set is getting tired now, unfortunately but its design avoids a thread 'running off' when done by hand.

Addendum - just looked up 'Greenfield' (the manufacturer). Still in business and making a vast array of taps / dies, mostly to the same pattern. Prices eye-watering.

Not eye watering .
Comensrate with the quality & difficulty of manufacture.
We seem t think everything should be cheap now days.
When in reality if things were a lot more expensive then we would be a lot more careful with our walletts and the planet would not be in the state it is  at the moment ,
BAck in my youth, dad was the only person in the block with a circular bench saw so the handymen in the area would bring timber to our place to run it down
The man at the bottom of the street had the only electric welder so same story, need a weld go see Mr Fell .
Two doors up was the plumber and if you needed gas welding you went to his place .
Poppy was a tip truck owner and he had a lathe so when I needed to do some lathe work over to his place .
Now days every second person has a bench saw , power plane samding disc, belt sander , band saw, lathe, mill , oxy gear, TIG MIG & MAG welder ,Press etc etc etc .
Most are junk made in an Asian country to a very low price and sit in our sheds unused for 364 days a year .

When it comes to things like taps & dies we again buy junk that break off in the hole so then buy more junk to try & remove it.
For WW & BSP I still have both my grandfathers & fathers dies
For CEI I have the individual P & N dies I bought back in the 70's and they dont break when I cut threads in stainless
OTOH they cost a days wages for each one of them but over 50 years I think I have gotten my money's worth
We forget that we pay for things with hours of our labour so if you pay 10 minutes of your time for a die or tap then you have no reason to expect it to work for any more than 10 minutes .
I try to buy 2 piece split dies when I need them in thread sizes I do not have so I can adjust the fit of the threads.
As for the die holder , a quality one will have a guide to help you hold it square to the shaft either a bolt on units is a variety of sizes or an adjustable one ( not as good ) .